Narrator>> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs, and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina, family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.

♪ opening music ♪ <Amanda> Well, good evening, and thank you so much for joining us this Tuesday for Making It Grow .

We're coming to you from historic downtown Sumter where our studio is located.

And I'm Amanda McNulty, a Clemson horticulture agent, and we're always supposed to be involved in Continuing Education, and gosh, there's so many new things that come down the pike, and I don't have to Zoom or Skype much.

I just come here, and we have these brilliant guests.

And they just tell me all kinds of fascinating things.

It's just the very best job in the world.

We've got such fun things for you tonight.

We've got Maya Chapman, who is the 4-H Pollinator Ambassador.

We'll learn a little bit about that program.

And then Audubon's Beidler Forest... Ah, you know, you don't need to be going to Paris and Greece and all these places.

I mean, it would be nice, but just get on I-26 and drive down towards Charleston, and the Beidler Forest is there.

One of the most beautiful, remarkable spots in the world.

It really is.

It truly, truly is.

Another truly remarkable person is Terasa Lott, because she keeps her wits about her when I'm ding-a-ling-y, and Terasa keeps the Master Gardener program going, which means that she's got ding-a-ling-y people that she's got to try to keep - <Terasa> (laughing) - Oh, that's not true!

<Amanda> I think it must be a little bit like herding cats just the teeniest bit sometimes.

We're such a diverse crowd, don't you think?

<Terasa> We are, but that's what keeps things interesting.

It would be a dull life if we were all exactly the same.

<Amanda> That's true.

<Terasa> Our Master Gardeners are amazing, over 61,000 hours of volunteer service for our last year, which is incredible.

<Amanda> And, now that we're getting back out some, I think people enjoy just being able to talk to people.

And I think often I can imagine a Master Gardener in line at a gardener shop and just casually having a conversation and helping somebody.

I'm sure that a lot of times it doesn't have to be in a formalized situation.

It's just people striking up a conversation and saying, "Did you know so and so?"

<Terasa> Sure.

<Amanda> Anyway, thank you, Terasa.

And Stephanie Turner, who is the mother of the kitty named Special, and I think you have a new kitty now.

<Stephanie> Yes, we got a kitten.

Her name is Kiwi and she's torturing Special.

[laughter] <Amanda> But um, one thing you do as the Horticulture Agent in Greenwood, you don't torture people, and you seem to have such a great group of Master Gardeners up there.

<Stephanie> We do, we do.

That's one of the joys of my job, getting to work with a really active and passionate group of Master Gardeners is the Lakelands Master Gardeners Association.

<Amanda> Do some of them work at the monarch waystation?

Is that still in place up there in Greenwood?

<Stephanie> Yes, that's very much in place and being fostered.

That program continues on.

I often say in different talks and things that Greenwood is going to be an anomaly on the map.

Some time, entomologists are going to be, "Why is there so many monarch eggs and caterpillars in our area?"

because we really are working hard at it.

<Amanda> Because you have the place that we went to where a gentleman comes and counts the eggs, and then y'all have places where you've planted the food to support them.

>> Yes, there's a whole pollinator garden in the uptown, and we appreciate the city of Greenwood for fostering that program and providing those areas where they don't spray insecticides, and we have a good group that go out there and look for the eggs and measure the different instars of the caterpillar and report that back.

That's citizen science.

<Amanda> That's people who really have nice, strong eyeglasses too.

<Stephanie> Oh, they're on their backs.

They're on their knees, and all up under everything, yeah.

[laughter] <Amanda> Well, it is a beautiful, beautiful city, and I know that you and your Master Gardeners enjoy working with such a cooperative city government.

<Stephanie> Oh, yes.

It is a big blessing.

<Amanda> And then, I'm gonna let you introduce somebody who's almost as special as the kitty.

[laughs] <Stephanie> Yes.

Today with me, I've brought Tom Nelson.

He is a Master Gardener and a member of the Lakelands Master Gardener Association in Greenwood, and a wealth of knowledge and great support for the program and his fellow Master Gardener, so... <Amanda> So Tom, what are some of the things that you most enjoy among the various opportunities that y'all have as a Master Gardener in Greenwood?

<Tom> One of the things that I enjoy participating in is, Greenwood, of course, sponsors the Festival of Flowers.

<Amanda> Yes!

<Tom> And the city has how many, 40?

<Stephanie> More than 40 topiaries.

<Tom> 40 topiaries, and the Master Gardener volunteers help to propagate the plants that go into those topiaries.

So one of the things that I have really enjoyed is seed propagate or seed starting and vegetative propagation; things that I had not previously really done much of, and it's a great sense of joy to start those things and then to go back and check on all my little - <Amanda> - And to see them on the streets!

<Tom> Exactly...yes.

<Amanda> I mean, they're exquisite, diversity and color and size and it's just, it's crazy.

It's just such, I mean, it's just having fun, fun, fun, fun, fun.

Isn't it?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

<Tom> Very much.

<Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

Well, we are so glad that you made the trip down and joined us today, and that you are such a wonderful asset to the Master Gardener Program up there.

Terasa, sometimes we have Gardens of the Week where people send in pictures sometimes to you directly through T-E-R-A-S-A @clemson.edu, or send them by Facebook or things.

And then you make a non judgmental collection of them to show us.

<Terasa> That's right.

We try to just pick a random sampling.

We couldn't possibly show all the photos that are submitted, but this has become like a virtual field trip around the state to see what you're doing in your yards, gardens, perhaps a beautiful place you visited in South Carolina.

So, today we're going to begin in the Lowcountry with Sandy Pate, Now, she's shared a plant with a rather difficult scientific name, Gomphocarpus physocarpus.

It used to be in the genus Asclepias, but this is sometimes called Balloon Plant.

This is one of the milkweeds, but it's native to South Africa.

<Amanda> Oh!

<Terasa> Rebecca Milford shared a bee visiting a passion flower, and on the same plant you can see the Gulf fritillary caterpillar.

That's, of course, the host plant for that caterpillar.

From Annette Barrett, we have Cutleaf coneflower, Rudbeckia laciniata.

Virginia James captured a predator-prey relationship on her watermelon plant.

It looks like one of the jumping spiders has caught a cricket, and we wrap up today with Dragon's Breath Celosia, and that was sent in by Annette Mishoe.

So, thanks to all of you that submitted photos.

I encourage you whenever you see us make a post on Facebook to go ahead and post your photos in the comments there.

Or, as Amanda mentioned, you're welcome to email them to me as well.

<Amanda> Well, thank you so much.

Well, I have a new puppy.

He's ten months old, and I guess they stay puppies forever.

Blue is his name, because when all the puppies were born, they had a lot of pieces of yarn around 'em, and they put a different piece of color yarn on his neck, and he was blue, and now he gets Blue Wilderness food.

It's all kind of crazy, but anyway...

He's a half Boykin-half English Field Trial Cocker Spaniel.

But anyway, um, last night, he went out and came in, and then I was walking around to get some water or do something, and I noticed there was some liquid on the floor, and this beetle was in the middle of it.

And Blue apparently had found this beetle and decided to bring him in his mouth, and then gotten, I guess, gotten a lot of saliva or something and decided to maybe give him to me as a present.

And so he's been in the 'frigerator, but I'm gonna leave him out, and y'all can see that they do warm up, because I've told y'all before that if you want to have a junebug, they don't like to hold still while you tie a piece of string around their leg, so you put them in the refrigerator for a little bit, and then you can do it.

So, but Terasa or Stephanie, I think you've learned to use a lot of apps to identify things.

<Stephanie> Yes, yeah.

<Amanda> So tell me what you found out about my new friend.

<Stephanie> So that is a triceratops beetle, and he has some little horns.

<Amanda> He does have some horns.

Yes, he does.

<Stephanie> And it is... the larva is a wood boring insect, and it does feed on decaying wood.

<Amanda> I've got lots of - <Stephanie> Likes oak.

<Amanda> Yeah, there's lots of stuff in my yard that would fit that category.

[laughter] <Stephanie> And the adult feeds on the larva of other wood boring insects.

And apparently it's one that beetle connoisseurs like to keep as a pet that can live up to two years.

<Amanda> So, I've gotten to think - Oh, there!

He's moving around a little bit now.

[silence] <Terasa> Looks like he's doing little beetle calisthenics over there.

<Stephanie> Yeah, some beetle yoga?

<Amanda> Beetle yoga.

[laughter] <Stephanie> Yeah, there's some great apps, whenever you find an insect, that if you want to learn more about it, there's one called iNaturalist, and that's also used for a lot of great citizen science projects, as well, because then you can also put a location to where you found that insect, and then other people, researchers can use that as references.

And there's a great community on that app.

So if you've identified something wrong, chances are someone will come along and say, "No, that's actually this," and help you and correct your identification, as well.

<Amanda> Well, and, you know, we're seeing so much, the range of so many animals and even plants expanding or being or retracting, and sadly, in some cases, as we have changes in our climate.

<Stephanie> That's right.

<Amanda> And so I imagine that this...could be an important tool in amassing and assessing that knowledge too, perhaps.

<Stephanie> Yeah, or, you know, just monitoring pollinators, and, you know, there's all kinds of different applications for it, I think, it really opens up a world of opportunity for citizens to get involved and help feedback information.

So, and it's fun to use, but you know, like any technology, you have to use it judiciously.

Right.

So I had a plant the other day in the office, and I used the app on the plant, and it had a little dark fruit on it, you know, podocarpus the fruit that it makes.

<Amanda> Yeah.

>> And it said it was a beetle.

[laughter] So, you know, you have to kind of verify behind your identifications.

<Amanda> Well, I think we can agree that this is a beetle.

<Stephanie> Yes.

>> And I'm gonna let him walk around for a while, and we'll see what he does during the show.

And then, <Terasa> iNaturalist is my favorite app, as well.

But there are some others.

There's a Seek, which is sort of a version of iNaturalist, but like Stephanie said, you know, kind of, it's a great first place to start, but then you need to do some, you know, other looking and verifying, and of course, you can still use field guides.

You know, good old fashioned field guides.

If you're someone that likes to have a book, you can, but the apps are going to be a little bit quicker way to get you headed in the right direction.

<Amanda> You know, the most - This I'm not saying this to denigrate any of the wonderful things that I've learned as an Extension agent, but at one of our meetings, a librarian came.

and she said, if you want to look something up, and you want to get past all the garbage, put Triceratops beetle, and then site, S-I-T-E : E-D-U, and you only get educational websites.

And that's the only way I look things up now mostly Terasa, or if I want to I could put site.gov <Terasa> Umm hmm.

Absolutely, that is great advice.

<Amanda> Don't you think?

>> Because anyone and everyone can put something on the internet and just because you read it doesn't necessarily mean it's true.

So, looking at those reputable .edu websites, .gov websites.

Umm hmm.

<Amanda> So I'll put the name of the of the thing that I'm interested in, and then you know, space and then site:edu with no spaces in between, and it's just been the most remarkable.

My mother was a reference librarian.

Of course, they didn't have anything like that, but it makes me think of her because, you know, it's just makes it so much easier to get true verifiable answers to things.

<Stephanie> ...and you can do a reverse image search too with Google.

If you have the image and you want to search the internet for something that looks like that image.

So, sometimes we can use that for a plant identification purpose.

<Amanda> I have to get you to show me how to do it.

<Amanda> Okay?

<Stephanie> Yeah!

<Amanda> I'm not - I have...some talents [laughter] <Stephanie> But it's also, built into, Is it just the iPhone, Terasa?

I'm not sure.

<Terasa> Yeah, newer versions.

I'm not sure where it started, but just the photos, if you just go into your photos on an iPhone, there's a little like a circle icon with an eye in it for information, and you can also use it to look up - it'll look up, So, put a picture of your dog in there and it will try to tell you the breed of the dog.

[laughter] <Amanda> I want it I want it to tell me when he's going to start chewing and everything.

in my house.

[laughter] Terasa, I had gone and gotten to the store and said, What's the thing that my dog - because he wants to pull the stuffing out of the thing.

<Terasa> Oh, yes.

<Amanda> And I said.

and they'll say, "Oh, he won't be "able to pull the stuffing."

I mean, five minutes later, our house looks like it's been pillow fights.

<Terasa>...but I think that's the fun, right?

Like the toy wouldn't be fun if you couldn't pull the stuffing out?

<Amanda> Well, that's obviously blues.

[laughter] So, I'd sew him back up, and then he'd da da da da.

Anyway.

How long do they usually keep chewing?

[silence] <Terasa> It depends on the dog.

<Amanda> Oh, goodness.

Let's do a plant question, Terasa.

[laughter] <Terasa> That's right.

We are about gardening, landscaping.

[laughter] I can talk for dogs about days.

Anyway, we have a question from Marilyn in Cheraw, or Cheraw?

I think is how you say it.

<Amanda> I say Cheraw.

>> ..right, that's how you're supposed to pronounce it.

This is, I'll call it a twofer, because she has more than one question about the same plant.

It's about her hydrangea.

She said she pruned it back in March.

"I cut it way down, "because I didn't want it to get too large."

And she sent him some photos.

"As you can see, it has lots of leaves, "but not one flower this season.

"My second picture shows brown spots "on some of the leaves.

"What could cause this?

I didn't fertilize it.

"Do you think it needs some?

If so, "when should I fertilize it?

"And what kind?"

Actually, so maybe there's three questions, <Amanda> That's a lot of questions.

<Terasa> We got a lot of questions.

[laughter] [Amanda sighs] Well, Stephie hydrangeas and when to prune and reblooming and not reblooming?

It's complicated and maybe more complicated, because that the some of the new varieties, but can you start us off with some explanations about this topic?

<Stephanie> Yes, sure.

So I'm actually going to start with the leaf spot.

So we can...maybe look at this leaf here, and <Amanda> And if you'll hold it real still or why don't you pull off one that's bad.

<Stephanie> Pull off one.

Yeah, that's a good idea.

<Amanda> If you don't mind my saying so.

<Stephanie> Okay.

<Amanda> ...and then maybe won't you just... Yeah.

Is that?

Yeah, that looks great.

Thank you.

<Stephanie> So, and you can see some of the spots have like a tannish center with a dark outside.

That's a common disease for a hydrangea.

It's a cercospora leaf spot.

And...that's going to happen towards the end of the season, especially aggravated by wet weather, poor air circulation, and it's not something that's going to cause a decline, you know, <Amanda> The leaves are gonna drop off anyway.

<Stephanie> They're going to drop off.

You can use a garden sanitation, basic, you know, cleaning up of the leaves, disposing of them, to kind of reduce the spread of it, the spores splashing around, but it's really not something besides being a slight eyesore that you need to be concerned about, and then sometimes you'll have these larger patches, and that's another disease called anthracnose, but that's still the same story.

<Amanda> Okay, so don't, it doesn't require that you get out of spray and do something It's just kind of the normal cycle of hydrangeas, and it's going to start over fresh next year anyways.

Is that correct?

<Stephanie> There will be fresh foliage next year.

Yeah.

It won't affect the plant until later in the season.

<Amanda> Okay, but is, so the lack of... green tissue, not being able to...photosynthesize, because of this browning was not enough to keep the plant from blooming though I don't think.

<Stephanie> Oh, no, no.

So and you know, we were just talking about this earlier today.

So I'm gonna let Tom talk a little bit about, you know, why maybe she didn't have any blooms this year.

<Tom> My... first guess, educated guess would be that the particular hydrangea that she has is one that blooms on old wood, as opposed to new wood, and so if she pruned it too late after the first or after blooms from the previous season, she then trimmed off the blooms for next year, as well, so.

<Stephanie> So, right at the beginning of the season, she pruned it and those were all those flower buds were on that material, she pruned off.

<Tom> Exactly.

<Amanda> So some plants take longer to initiate and develop the flower bud.

And so, some hydrangeas need a long time to initiate the flower bud, and have it develop that's going to bloom next year.

They just take longer to do that, but then certain other ones can do it pretty quickly, I guess.

So, let's continue that conversation.

<Tom> There is a particular hydrangea that is you see a lot of now is the limelight hydrangea and it blooms on new wood.

So, if you wait until after spring and things are beginning to leaf out, you can prune the limelights, and they will put on new growth, and on the end of that new growth, you will get a pretty panicle of white flowers.

<Amanda> And I think, - Do you have some?

<Stephanie> Oh, we have some.

One of them is as big as my head?

<Amanda> Whoa!

[laughter] <Amanda> Why don't you do the hat, this show?

[laughter] <Stephanie> So this one is limelight but it's a panicle type, and that's just one of the cultivars that it could, you know, of a panicle type hydrangea.

They and you know, if you don't know what kind you have, you can always ask us in Extension, but a good rule of thumb is the earlier in the season that they bloom, the more indication that it was an old wood, right?

So these bloom, later in the season, they're blooming on new wood.

So, it had to have time for the new wood to set in, and so these will bloom late July.

<Tom> You can actually, see that new wood back?

<Stephanie> Yeah, so you can see, <Tom> - this year's growth.

<Stephanie> The green stem, <Amanda> Oh yes, you can.

<Stephanie> Right!

<Amanda> Why don't you strip some leaves off so we can really see the brown and the green.

<Stephanie> So...and then another nice thing to know about these, <Amanda> Hold it real still, so they can get that picture.

<Stephanie> There you go!

<Amanda> ..and then back, see farther back, you can see the brown that was last year's.

So this was defi-... that Greenwood is what came out this spring.

Yeah, and that... <Stephanie> and this is a newer flower.

It's whiter, creamier white color, and this is an older flower on the same shrub, and you do want to wait.

These are great for drying.

So you want to wait till it gets to about this stage here, where the bracts are really firm, and that's a great stage to go ahead and cut, stem and dry it.

<Amanda> -having a tiny bit of brown occasionally on a few of them.

I see.

<Stephanie> Yeah.

<Amanda> So, how do you go about drying them?

<Stephanie> Personally, I just cut them, peel off the strip off the leaves and stick them in a vase, and then they will just dry just fine.

You don't have to do anything else further.

<Amanda> Okay, and then there are reblooming hydrangeas, and that's a whole different bailiwick.

So, let's talk about those too.

<Stephanie> So yeah, reblooming would be that they would then they would bloom in the spring on old wood and then continue to bloom on new wood, as well.

So, there's not there's not an interruption of bloom.

<Amanda> So you can cut those back, and then when Terasa when we were at Clemson, Edward was in the art department, which was the architecture department and the architects who had to make models of their houses or buildings or developments would go to the mountains sometimes to collect one of our native hydrangea, dry blooms that go up in the fall.

The hydrangea arborescens which is a native, and I think Annabelle is a cultivar of that?

<Terasa> I believe so and that one in the fall, it dried, and had perfect little things that they could cut up and they look like little trees and Annabelle hydrangea is one that you can mow it down and it'll come back and just bloom its head off.

<Terasa> I don't think we, we talked about this being a panicle or Hydrangea paniculata and then arborescens, I believe is your smooth hydrangea.

The original question that Marilyn was talking about, she probably has what I would think about, just like the old fashioned the mop head or macrophylla.

<Amanda> - and the pink and <Terasa> -the pink and blue.

Yes, sometimes can they can change color.

We say it's the pH It's not really the...

The pH determines the availability of aluminum I believe, and that's what's actually responsible for the differences in the color.

<Amanda> So hydrangeas, it's a complicated thing.

It really is.

[Terasa laughs] <Terasa> We have one size doesn't fit all.

<Stephanie> We have a great factsheet all about it.

It talks about changing the pH or the color.

It talks about the different types and when to prune.

So, our HGIC factsheet is excellent.

<Amanda> I think I interrupted you.

How do we dry those?

If we wanted to, <Stephanie> Oh, I just put them in a vase I'd strip off the leaves... <Amanda> Oh, you don't have to hang them upside down?

<Stephanie> You don't have to hang them upside down They're very firm, <Amanda> Oh!

>> and full so they just, I just put them in the vase and they slowly dry and that's how my arrangement stays for it will stay that way, for years.

They don't, <Amanda> And some of them are real big and some of them are real small.

The hybridization that goes on I think they're cultivars, little limelights and then they're... <Stephanie> a lot.

Yeah.

There's a bunch of different cultivars of the panicle hydrangeas, for sure.

<Amanda> Gosh, hydrangeas are kind of confusing.

<Terasa> Yeah, and there's oak leaf too.

That's a native.

I didn't mention the oakleaf hydrangea.

<Amanda> So beautiful.

Yeah, and holds its flowers throughout.

I love it when they start to mature in the fall.

Don't you?

Yeah, yeah.

Oh goodness.

I think poor Terasa.

Usually, you start us off with Garden spotlight and here I brought out my bug, and then we got way off track.

So, my insect excuse me.

He's not a bug.

[laughter] <Terasa> You're right.

Well, we do have a spotlight.

We're going to travel outside of our state to our neighboring North Carolina, to the home of Bruce Duncan.

Now, he's in Fallston, which is located in 7b.

So we're gonna see some things that we might not be used to seeing.

Bruce has worked really hard at amending his clay soil, and so we start our tour with his front yard which prominently displays a variety of conifers.

In his backyard, there are flower gardens that flank each side of the vegetable garden.

Bruce noted that deer and other hungry critters have resulted in the creation of a fence around his vegetable garden.

[Amanda laughs] Weeping Hemlock, prostrate, growing white pine and bugle weed serve as a ground cover plus annuals and those are the prominent subjects in this view and we see the vegetable garden in the background.

To the side of his porch we see weeping white spruce, gold thread cypress and one of his favorites, a dwarf oriental spruce called Firefly.

We conclude our tour of Bruce's yard with a look at Acrocona Norway spruce and blue Boulevard false cypress on the left of his stone walkway.

So, thank you for the wonderful tour, Bruce.

It was especially interesting to see something a little bit different than I would certainly see in my backyard in Darlington, South Carolina.

<Amanda> What zone do you think he's in?

<Terasa> 7b.

I looked it up.

7b.

<Amanda> Because those are things we can't do.

Yeah.

We're not going to have those spruces and things down here?

<Terasa> No.

<Amanda> Not very long.

<Terasa> And Bruce had done a video with a local garden center, and so I was able to learn a little bit more.

And he was talking about some techniques that he uses for planting the conifers where he actually does not dig a hole but puts them on top of the soil and then puts soil around them so that he's, you know, not having issues with poor drainage.

<Amanda> Oh, okay.

Also, I guess, if you want to, I was talking with someone the other day about peonies, and in order to see that they get they got more of the cold, she was raising the beds.

So, they had less insulating soil around them, which I thought was interesting.

Not not making a wooden raised bed, but just you know, using her own native soil to make a raised bed, which I thought <Terasa> - getting that micro climate.

<Amanda> Yeah, I mean, it does, It would make a difference, you know, a little bit, I think anyway.

Well, my fellow here is, <Terasa> trying to escape.

Yeah, he's getting ready to go.

So, if he comes over your way, you need to wrestle him back.

[all laugh] ...Ben Powell, who's our apiculture specialist, organized a tremendous beekeepers - well, the beekeepers organized it, actually.

They are just wonderful people and Ben made arrangements for us to come there, and we met a lovely young woman.

These 4-Hers, I mean to tell you this, the grass isn't growing under their feet, there's now a 4-H pollinator program, and we'd like to talk a little bit about that.

[silence] <Amanda> Mya, you've been a 4-H'er for a long time <Mya> I have been a 4-Her for 10 years.

<Amanda> And you've probably had several 4-H coordinators.

<Mya> I do.

<Amanda> Okay, and so what are some of the things you remember when you were young?

<Mya> When I was young, I remember doing a Healthy Living commercial with Mrs. Molly Spearman <Mya> in my home town.

<Amanda> Oh no?

Did you?

<Mya> Yes, ma'am!

<Amanda> And so there's a new national project, that's a 4-H project?

Well, tell us a little about what it is?

<Mya> The national 4-H honeybee project is to teach, to advocate and to educate all over the world about the importance of honeybees and honey pollinators and pollinators in general, because they're going through a rough time, and people just don't care about them like they used to.

<Amanda> Well, and as somebody who's in horticulture who knows all these wonderful master gardeners, I kind of have a different view, because we really do get real excited about it, but you're right, a lot of people are afraid of bees.

<Mya> They are.

>> ...and they're not aggressive.

If you just mind your own business.

>> Right.

<Amanda> It's been fun to learn too that when they're swarming, they're really not aggressive.

<Mya> I know.

>> So did you, did y'all take classes with your 4-H leader to learn about honeybees?

<Mya> Yes, ma'am.

Mr. Ben Powell, actually did a Zoom call a few weeks ago, and he taught us the importance of not only being a beekeeper, but a bee watcher and ensuring that your hives and colonies are doing the best for them in their environment.

<Amanda> And so, within the state of South Carolina, there's a number of you 4-H'ers who are in this program?

<Mya> Yes, ma'am.

Six of us actually got to go to DC for the National Summit.

>> Whoa!

Were you one of those six?

<Mya> Yes, ma'am.

I was.

<Amanda> Come on!

Dang, that's kind of exciting, isn't it?

Yeah, yeah.

And so, did y'all, so y'all had special programs there?

Or did y'all even learn more there <Mya> Yes, ma'am.

than you do already?

So I wonder, do you have any bees at your house?

<Mya> I do.

I have two colonies so far.

<Amanda> Do you?

Okay, and are you in a rural setting?

Are you...?

>> I am.

I live on a 33 acre farm.

<Amanda> That's pretty good.

So what do y'all grow?

What do you think the bees are most attracted...?

Is the main food for the bees on your farm?

<Mya> Right now we have sunflowers and other types of flowers made through seed bombs, which we actually teach youth how to make their own seed bombs and just throw them out.

The seed bombs are these little clay balls with seeds all over them and you throw them at trees.

and flowers just start (Amanda laughs) growing and it attracts all kinds of pollinators and just so they can get the pollen for their selves and for, to pollinate the flowers.

<Amanda> Yeah, of course.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And it makes you know, agriculture such a big crop for us.

And, you know, I mean, it's, you know, in the summertime, watermelons.

<Mya> Yes, ma'am >> All those things have just, ( intelligible) Tomato is the buzz pollinator.

Buzz.

(laughs) So, how many years have you had hives of your own?

<Mya> I've had them since March, actually.

I'm really new to this, and I already love it so much.

<Amanda> Oh, you do?

>> Yes, ma'am.

What did your parents think about it?

<Mya> My mom and my dad were both really involved, and they both were scared to death, at first, but they were like, >> They were nervous.

>> We're gonna do it.

Really?

Okay.

We're gonna do it.

And so, it wasn't like, they were just, - pushed it on.

<Mya> No.

This is something y'all all have kind of, <Mya> I had, <Amanda> tip-toed into.

<Mya> I first saw the ad for the honey bee project on the 4-H Facebook page, and I'm like, I've never done bees.

I'm going to do them this year, and we just started overnight.

It was like, boom, boom, boom, you're going to be a pollinator ambassador.

You're going to educate and advocate.

<Amanda> So have you given, have you given any talks locally?

<Mya> I have not yet but I am soon.

We're gonna start with our pollinator gardens all over the state, the six of us that went.

We're gonna start with our gardens here soon.

<Amanda> Are you?

<Mya> Yes ma'am.

<Amanda> So you're going to try to demonstrate some gardens.

Isn't that going to be fun?

<Mya> It is.

I'm really excited.

<Amanda> Thank you so much for talking to us today, and I'm going to get back with you again and hear about more fun places with you again.

<Mya> Thank you.

I really enjoyed it.

And I hope that more people are able to learn and apply to their lives how important honeybees are and other pollinators.

[silence] <Amanda> I think it's wonderful that young people are getting interested in pollinators because on pollinators are so important.

I think it's every third bite of food we eat, and fun to know about the 4-H'ers.

So, I had to take my car to have... my work vehicle fixed after a tree limb fell on it and after a bad storm and I had to take it be repaired, and I was looking for hat stuff and there was a wonderful thing of fabulous pokeweed but I had to go through a ditch to get through it.

So I'm just saying, don't think this stuff, just...so, but I used to sometimes dye my hair with poke berries.

I just wanted to show you how brilliant they can be.

It's a gorgeous color.

And um, you know, in the spring it used to be that poke salad was one of the first things that came up and with proper preparation, you can eat the very young leaves and imagine if you hadn't had a vegetable all winter long that would be a pretty happy thing to have.

My cousin's used to mix it with scrambled eggs.

My cousins who lived in the mountains.

Umm...okay.

<Terasa> Perhaps you've got a new we could make some rouge or blush with, <Amanda> Yeah, it would not be particularly subtle but, [laughter] Okay, so what have we got, Terasa?

<Terasa> Let's see.

Well, Ronnie wrote in and said, "I collected these creepy crawlies from my yard.

Can you tell me what they are and do they cause problems?

<Amanda> Okay, well, if you'd known how to use this iNaturalist thing, but then we wouldn't have people calling us.

So, Stephanie help us out here.

<Stephanie> Oh, yeah.

So, he has millipedes, which I often have to step back and remind myself of the difference between a millipede and a centipede, but millipedes like to feed on organic matter.

<Amanda> They have lots and lots of legs.

<Terasa> Lots and lots of legs.

<Stephanie> Well, so does... <Amanda> Two per, but two per segment.

<Stephanie> It has lots of lots of legs, but and you know, I guess it's not important except for that it is good to know that they're not there eating organic matter.

So that's a good way to modify the habitat.

Because centipedes are not vegetarians, they're going to be eating insects.

<Amanda> -and we're not supposed to pick centipedes up.

We can pick millipedes up.

<Stephanie> Yes, exactly.

The millipedes are fine.

But they can be a nuisance, because they can be in great numbers.

<Amanda> Okay.

<Stephanie> Then, so you'll find them in your driveway and your lawn and mulch, moist areas.

<Amanda> Just kind of a nuisance, not really doing... <Stephanie> They're kind of a nuisance.

<Stephanie> and you just want to, you can reduce the amount of organic matter.

So clean up leaf litter, clean up gutters, you know, areas where that stuff is moist and <Amanda> - accumulating.

<Stephanie> Yeah, and just do a better job with sealing around doorways and frames.

And we have a great fact sheet about it, as well.

<Amanda> Just Clemson HGIC millipedes.

<Stephanie> Millipedes.

<Amanda> Okay, thank you.

All right.

Well, Teresa, <Terasa> Let's see if we can help Gladys who has a weed problem.

She said, "This weed is "taking over.

It looks sort of like Mimosa "tree leaves.

What is it and how can "I control it?"

<Amanda> Uggh.

<Amanda> Okay, Tom, we've got, <Terasa> It's your favorite, weed.

<Amanda> We have three minutes, and that's not enough to really do great, but other than say this is the worst, most obnoxious weed.

<Tom> It is, and control is the operative word.

The best way to start is by getting on your hands and knees and pull it out of the ground.

Once it has begun its growth cycle.

That way you interrupt the production of seed pods which form on the undersides of the leaves, in little wart like structures.

and those seed pods don't just drop seeds, they explode seeds, so they go everywhere.

But the first line of defense, hands and knees, pull them out.

You can also apply preemergents.

I use a product, and I'll just spell it, I-S-O-X-A-B-E-N. <Amanda> And all that's written at HGIC.

I think they give you several opportunities.

Yeah.

<Tom> And you apply twice, <Amanda> Follow the directions <Tom> Exactly.

Once in the two weeks of, the first two weeks of April, and then again in the first two weeks of June, and that will help to suppress the weed germination or the seed germination.

Beyond that, you can use some other post emergent herbicides, but the caution that I would give there is that, <Amanda> I don't think that's such a great idea, personally.

<Tom> No, I think your best bet is to just pull them out.

<Amanda> Yeah, and they are it is a nuisance.

and so one thing is I think we bring these things home with us in new plants.

So it's so um, sometimes it's good to take soil off new plants you bring home.

Okay, well, we had said earlier that one of the most marvelous places truly in the world is right here in South Carolina, and it's the Audubon Beidler Forest.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [silence] >> This is a gloriously, beautiful South Carolina day, and I'm speaking with Matt Johnson, who is the Director of the Beidler Forest Audubon Center.

Matt, thank you for letting us come, and we're it seems like we're in the middle of just - the garden of Eden, but actually we're between Columbia and Charleston, right off I-26, and there are signs that tell us how to get here.

>> That's right.

Right off I-26 whether you're coming from Charleston or from Columbia, you can find us.

We're a little off the beaten path, which we like, but what a beautiful place, what a beautiful day.

We're in the spring, which is my favorite time of the year, and welcome, to the Beidler Forest Audubon Center.

It's 18 thousand acres of land here in the Four Hole Swamp, watershed.

It takes up parts of Dorchester.

Berkeley and Orangeburg counties.

<Amanda> How did it start?

When did y'all acquire the original property?

<Matt> Sure, so in the 1960s, this property was originally protected, and it was only about 35 hundred acres at the time.

Never been logged.

Really, never been significantly impacted by people and the Audubon Society and the Nature Conservancy got together, protected it and purchased it from the Beidler family, who owned a lot of land in this area, but had not logged or really done anything with this little part of Four Hole Swamp.

So, it was protected in the 1960s sixties.

We opened it up to the public for the first time in the mid-1970s and we're still open today, and we've turned that 3,500 acres into over 18 thousand acres of protected land today.

<Amanda> Explain to me what a swamp is, and what the impact of this is.

How much drainage comes into it?

<Matt> Good question.

So, swamps, really at the basic level are flooded forests.

You combine trees.

You combine water.

This particular swamp Four Hole Swamp is fed entirely by rainfall.

It starts up near St. Matthews, an area that you know, and it runs for about 60 miles down into, eventually into the Edisto River, near the town of Ridgeville, and being fed entirely by rainfall, you have a really vast area that nearly floods down to a sort of a more narrow area.

So, a couple hundred thousand acres of land that drains down to about 30 or 40 thousand acres that makes up the flow of the swamp.

>> And so why is that so important that we have all these trees, and obstacles I guess I'd say to the flow of water, and what impact does that have on cleanliness and creating habitat?

>> Right.

Great question, and we think about the habitat that swamps provide.

We think about habitat for wildlife, right.

And certainly, this is a sanctuary for birds, and us being Audubon, we always care about the birds and other wildlife as well, but swamps and other wetlands serve some really important functions also.

One of them is they make the water cleaner.

So, when water flows through swamps, it's cleaner when it leaves than when it comes in.

Swamps naturally filter and purify water.

So, the more wetlands we have, the cleaner our water is, especially if that water is the source of our drinking water, and in a lot of cases, it is.

So, because it's soil here the impurities can filter down into the ground, and that incredible biome, I mean, the organisms that are under the ground are just so remarkable at degrading any impurities and turning them into usable nutrients.

>> That's exactly right, and when I talk to people here at Beidler and I say you look out you see an ecosystem, but under the water and under the ground, there's a whole other ecosystem that we really can't see, that's this doing really important work for us, filtering water.

You talked about the slow moving water.

I mean all these extreme weather events that we've had in recent years in South Carolina, swamps in the wetlands doing a really important role during that.

<Amanda> Well, we're surrounded by trees, and we had a meeting tree that we saw, that you said was probably well over a thousand years old, and as we look around, I see a little, tiny young cypress tree.

So, we're not going to see all gigantic trees because there have been natural occurrences, such as hurricanes.

<Matt> That's exactly right.

So, when we think about, there hasn't been any logging here.

It doesn't mean that no trees have fell.

So, one of the hallmarks of an old grove swamp, is yes you do get some old trees, but usually you have things at every stage of life and death.

Lots of standing trees, but also lots of dead trees, and so, our sort of mission here at Beidler is completely hands off.

We let the swamp be as natural as it is, and so if a hurricane comes and it knocks a tree down, we leave it on the ground.

If a lightning strikes a tree and causes it to catch fire, we leave it standing.

The only time we cut a tree is if it falls across the boardwalk, and then we leave everything on the ground in the swamp.

So, it's a very natural ecosystem, because as you know Amanda, a fallen tree is still very valuable to the wildlife.

<Amanda> Absolutely, yeah, but we also have the factor of carbon storage, not only with what we see here, but I know I've been doing some work in my yard, and trying to plant some things, and Oh my Lord!

The root systems of things are just incredible.

>> That's exactly right, especially when you think about native plants, native trees, native grasses.

They store incredible amounts of carbon.

So, when we think about a changing climate, the more carbon we can store, the better.

So, a very important role that Beidler and other forests and wetlands are playing is storing carbon, not just above ground, but to your point, a lot of that carbon storage is just below the surface of the ground.

>> Because it had never been logged, this was a kind of unknown unused area, and y'all have been doing history and getting designations and accolades for things here, and one of the most recent interesting things, I think, as you found out that this was a place that had a role in the Underground Railroad System when enslaved people were trying to get to places where they would be able to live as freed people.

>> That's exactly right.

So, by the way, we're very proud to be a Ramsar Wetland of international importance.

This is a national, natural landmark.

It's a globally important bird area.

<Amanda> Globally important, <Matt> Yes, but also, and I think perhaps, we're most proud of our most recent designation as that Beidler was named as a site on the National Park Service's Underground Railroad Network to Freedom Program, and you're exactly right.

We have evidence now that freedom seekers that were referred to as Maroons lived in and traveled through swamps, including Four Hole Swamp as they were trying to become free, and they would - Some may have stayed here for short periods of time.

Others built encampments and lived in the swamp.

So, it was truly a sanctuary as people tried to get away from that very horrible thing that was happening.

<Amanda> And of course there was no boardwalk, so highly unlikely that people were going to be passing through here.

When you were in here, you were very unlikely to run into anybody else and anybody looking for you was very unlikely to come into this, because as you said, this is where we're at right now, is one of the lowest of water levels that you've see during the year.

>> Sure right, very dry and what's amazing about coming here and walking on our boardwalks.

We have an almost two mile boardwalk that goes out to the old grove parts of the swamp is that you can visualize what it would've looked like 200 years ago, 500 years ago, and it's changed some, but not a lot to people that might have used a swamp, whether they be the ruins, whether they be Native Americans and you can touch trees like the Meeting Tree that have been alive for a thousand years, and you might think that people that were here in the past put their hands against that very same tree and it's still alive and still here today.

<Amanda> One of the cool things about cypress trees of course, is in wet areas, they put up those knees and you say that, because of that, we can talk about this unusual bird that sometimes takes advantage of those.

>> That's exactly right.

We have this really unique species here, and at this time of the year.

Here we are in early April people are coming out here to see it.

It's called the prothonotary warbler.

It's a tricky name and I guess maybe the better pronunciation would be (pro-tha-notary) and a prothonotary was a clerk in the Roman Catholic Church that wore these bright yellow flowing robes, and so it was reminiscent of the appearance of this bird, which is bright yellow, but the other nick name for it is the Swamp Canary.

And I think it's a good nickname, not only because the bird's bright yellow like a canary, but like the canary of the coal mine, these birds are a great indicator of the health of a wetland ecosystem.

We tend to see them growing or living in areas where there's standing water.

So, they're susceptible to changes in hydrology, changes in the flow of the water.

They also eat things like, we were looking at a mayfly earlier.

Mayflies come up out of the water as part of their life and they are also tied to water quality.

So, in areas where the water is not very clean, sometimes you don't have quite as many mayflies and that can impact the food web as it applies to this very special bird of ours.

<Amanda> Because birds almost all birds like to feed their young insects, because they need that protein because they have to get up and learn how to fly and mature very quickly and this bird really speeds up that process.

>> Speeds it up very quickly.

So, we see them nesting in the cypress knees, and here the cypress knees are so big and old that they start to hollow out, and then these warblers, which is interesting, because it's the only warbler in the eastern United States that nests in cavities.

All the other warblers built an open nest, only the prothonotary will nest inside of a structure So, you can actually put - if you took your bluebird box, Amanda and you put out into a swamp - >> Guess what I get - >> - a warbler box, but here they nest in the cypress knees and it is amazing.

We see them nesting.

>> But they do create a nest.

>> They do make a nest, they're just inside of the structure.

Good point.

and what's amazing is they do everything very quickly.

So, from when they start to lay eggs in the nest until when those young are big enough to leave the nest, is only three weeks.

<Amanda> Gosh that's fast.

>> So fast.

And actually, from when the eggs hatch to when they can leave the nest is 10 days.

<Amanda> In the way that we think about the monarch butterflies and at first, we just thought plant milkweed, plant milkweed, plant milkweed, then we realized well, if we can do that, but if they don't have the other end of their migratory route is not safe.

We got to start looking at what's happening there and so y'all didn't know quite what the prothonotaries were doing, when they left, and I think you've done some fascinating work to figure out what is going on.

So, tell us about that.

>> Sure, I've been lucky enough to be working with the species for the time that I work for Audubon, and yeah, they arrive in about the beginning of April.

They nest here at Beidler.

We think we've done a pretty good job of protecting habitat for them, while they're here, and then they leave in late July and August.

But where do they go?

And we think at a global or at a global scale their populations are declining.

So, the question was why, and when we think about bird conservation, especially for these birds that migrate.

To your point, we can't just protect one piece of their habitat.

We got piece together the whole journey, but first we have to understand what that journey is.

So, we have been for the last couple of years, studying the birds here at Beidler as part of a project being done across their range.

So, working with partners in Virginia and Ohio and Louisiana and Arkansas and all over.

So, we attached these little or tracking devices to these birds, to actually, study their migration, and so we did that - <Amanda> Like a little backpack.

<Matt> Like a little backpack.

It goes on their back.

It's not a GPS unit, so the catch is, we put it on the bird in one year, the bird flies off.

It goes on this journey.

It comes back, hopefully.

What's amazing about prothonotaries is they will come back to the same spot year after year after year, and then we can catch them again, and remove this device and then hopefully get the data that tells us where they went.

So, they're migrating at night and they're migrating across the Gulf of Mexico, across the Caribbean, down through Central America, into like Columbia, South America.

That's a one-way trip of about 2,500 miles.

<Amanda> And then coming back.

>> And then coming back.

So five thousand miles.

These bird weigh about 15 grams, which if you could imagine like two quarters in your hand.

The little devices that we've been putting on them are like half of a gram, and through this little device, we've been able to learn quite a bit about where they go and how they're getting there.

And so now we're working with partners in places like Colombia, South America to talk about habitat protection to understand what the prothonotary workers are doing down there.

So that really, we can hopefully protect their full life cycle, the breeding grounds, the wintering grounds and everything in between.

<Amanda> And everything in between, because they've got to stop and eat and rest, and do all that.

If you drive 2,500 miles, you can't do that in a day.

It's not an airplane trip for them.

<Matt> It still never ceases to amaze me how these little, tiny birds can travel five thousand miles, and not just come back to Beidler, but some of them come back to the exact same cavity from one year to the next.

<Amanda> Goodness.

Site loyalty.

>> Site loyalty or site fidelity.

>> Fidelity <Matt> And we see that with salmon and fish and all sorts of different organisms do that, and these birds do it too.

<Amanda> Yeah.

Something we haven't talked about is just the joy for human beings to come here, and have this experience.

I mean, my anxiety level is dramatically lower than it was earlier, and I know that y'all have had limited visitation during the pandemic, but even during normal times, when you can have a lot of people here, it's such a large area, and there's so much to do that there is, anybody can get a sense of tranquility and peace and calm, and come and have this experience that just isn't there in many other places.

>> That's exactly right.

One of the things I love about Beidler, it's a great way to experience all the senses, like we're listening to birds in the background, and take deep breaths out here and just a nice fresh scent, because of course these trees are also an oxygen factory here in the swamp.

>> As you were walking around we saw all kinds of snakes.

We saw all kinds of insects.

We saw crawdads.

>> Such a great way - >> Caterpillars.

>> to let your imagination run wild.

So, yes.

We are open to the public.

Right now, we're open Thursday, Fridays and Saturdays.

People can register to come out on our website and explore this boardwalk, which is, as I said, is almost two miles in length.

It makes a big loop right down to the old grove parts of the swamp, and during the pandemic, we opened a new trail system that goes through some of the habitats that we're restoring, longleaf pine and native grasslands near the entrance to Beidler.

We have lots of things for people to do here.

>> The only thing that you can't do here is run out and buy a hamburger.

So bring a picnic lunch.

>> Bring a picnic lunch.

We have picnic tables.

It's a great place to come and spend the day, spend the afternoon or the morning, but it's a good place to bring a snack and some water with you.

>> Well, it has just been wonderful.

Thank you for the work that y'all are doing here, and for the opportunity to let South Carolinians and people from all over the country understand the importance of a place being preserved and how it ties in so much farther than just a place halfway between Columbia and Charleston.

>> Oh, absolutely.

Thank you Amanda for your interest, and we'd love to have you and everybody come out to visit.

♪ acoustic instrumental ♪ ♪ <Amanda> So make this, any time of the year, the fall would be a glorious, glorious time to go when the cypress trees start changing colors.

Thank y'all all for being with us tonight, and we'll see you next week and my beetle says, good night as well.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ Narrator>> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs, and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina, family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.

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