♪ Gavin Jackson> Welcome to the "South Carolina Lede" and "This Week in South Carolina" crossover episode here at SCETV Studios in Columbia.

I'm Gavin Jackson.

Joining me along with this, wonderful crowd for our 2026 legislative session preview is South Carolina Public Radio's Maayan Schechter.

And our special guest, House Speaker Murrell Smith of Sumter.

Welcome to you both.

And welcome to our studio audience.

How excited is everyone for the 2026 session?

(applause) It's just like being in the House chamber, Speaker.

(laughter) Spk.

Murrell> Not as rowdy.

Gavin> We'll get there.

Right?

That being said, Speaker Smith, thank you again for being with us.

The House Republican Caucus rolled out its agenda in December.

You guys had a press conference.

We were there for that.

Reiterate those priorities for us, set the scene for this final year of the two year session.

>> Yeah, in this legislative session, you're going to see us focus on three things.

You'll see us focus on taxes and tax reduction.

You're going to see us, focus on infrastructure and also public safety.

Those have been three cornerstones that we have, worked on this past session.

And then we're going to and we hopefully will lead with some new legislation on some tax reform.

And obviously, you know, we have the infrastructure, ad hoc committee that has been put together and that they will be introducing a bill within the next week, I believe.

And then, we'll continue our focus on making South Carolina safe.

And public safety has been a huge part of it.

And we're going to continue to do that, especially concentrating on some juvenile crime issues.

Unfortunately, what's happened is, gangs and cartels have realized that juveniles don't have the same consequences as, as adults.

And so they're using them to commit, some of the crimes and commit some of the gang, and drug trafficking that they have done.

But more, more importantly, what I have seen over the years, the rise in violent crime by juveniles.

And that's a there's a number of ways we got to attack that.

You got to attack that by given wraparound services by creating, options and other, other things for them to do other than join the gangs and being, be involved in crime.

But most importantly, there have to be consequences.

And if you're going to commit adult violent crimes, then you're going to have to suffer the consequences of that.

And so you'll see us really focus on that part first.

And Brandon Cox, who, from Berkeley County, put together a little committee within the last few weeks of, 2026, 2025.

And he is going to continue to roll out this bill on the juvenile crime and then continue with other bills to follow.

So you'll see a real focus on that.

Gavin> Because y'all did pass that smash and grab bill?

Right?

Wasn't that last... Spk.

Murrell> Retail theft...from last year?

We did that last year as well as the fentanyl death bill.

We passed the anti-squatters bill in the House last year.

So we've done a number of focused over the years on trying to make sure that South Carolinians can feel safe in their homes and feel safe in the communities.

Gavin> I know one of the priorities that's not on your list is redistricting.

We've talked about this, but I want to get you on it right now because it's the new year.

We're starting off.

There's still talk about this, not necessarily within your caucus, but with some members in the House, mid-cycle redistricting, which is something that gained traction across the country.

President Donald Trump's behest.

We have seven congressional districts in the state, six, all Republican, followed the last redrawing of districts and one solid Democrat.

On Wednesday, Senate Republican leadership said that such redistricting is unlikely this session, though some in the House would like to see it.

Would you agree with the Senate's summation of this?

Spk.

Murrell> I would agree with the Senate's summation of that, as well, as what Governor McMaster has said, when, when you look at the districts, I think South Carolina was ahead of the curve because then, when we redistricted in 2020, 2020, you remember we had, we had a two Democrats and, and five Republicans, and we took Charleston, the first Congressional District and made that where it would lean Republican, because at that point, the United States Supreme Court had said partisanship was not a prohibitive element under the Voting Rights Act.

And we obviously were sued.

We went to court, and I will give it credit to the General Assembly.

As we didn't... we lost in the trial court.

We went up to the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals.

We lost there, and we took it all the way to the Supreme Court and won.

They overturned.

They held it, held up our maps.

So we got a 6 to 1 advantage.

And I think when you, when you look at where you're going, the maps that I have seen and the numbers I have seen from the proposals still has a district that is going that, leans heavily Democrat.

And so I think what, Senator Massey said was that we better be careful because we could end up with a 5 to 2 or 4 to 3, and that would not, that would defeat the whole purpose of going through reapportionment.

Gavin> How come that message isn't resonating enough, you think?

Spk.

Murrell> Because, it's technical.

You know that.

People speak in sound bites and, and those can be always juicy, but when you get into the details, you got to understand it.

And that's part about being a politician and being a statesman.

You have to.

You have to, when you are governing and you're trying to lead the state and improve your state.

You've got to get into the details and look at the consequences that what, what may what your obvious consequences and the unintended consequences.... <Maayan?> Maayan> I want to follow up on one of the priorities that I think probably everyone in this room and everyone in South Carolina talks about, and you've kind of previewed it, roads, infrastructure, talking about that D.O.T.

modernization committee that you created that's been meeting over the past year.

And like you said, we'll have a bill.

We know that the bill is supposed to address policy and spending initiatives as it relates to infrastructure.

What do you hope to see in this bill?

What can South Carolina, South Carolinians expect to see?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, if you've been to Charleston, you've been to Greenville, and maybe even here in Columbia, you understand that congestion is real and congestion is wasting people's time, and it's making it more difficult to get to your jobs, and it affects your quality of life.

So we've got to do something about that.

That's why I put together this committee, and you will see us focus on issues, of trying to decongest the urban areas and also continue on the rural, safety plan and make sure most, that most of our rural areas are paid attention to so, so to speak, and that they are safe because most deaths in this state occur in the rural areas.

And so you have to put a focus on that and the roads, because those are the most dangerous roads.

But you also have to deal with congestion.

So what you'll see here is you going to see first this is going to be a three pronged attack.

First, you got to deal with all these unnecessary regulations.

And...thank goodness we have President Trump in office and his D.O.T.

Secretary are doing a great jobs of trying to reduce those impediments that cause the inflation and the cost of roads.

And so, you know, one thing, one statistic that sticks out to me is that is, you know, is 2017 is when we passed the gas tax and we raised the tax to 28 cents.

One penny of that gas tax, one penny of 28 cents did, paved 114 miles of roads in 2017.

Now we're at 84.

So that shows you the inflation that we've gone through in, in there.

So we have to make sure that we reduce those regulations.

We got to make sure that we innovate.

And when you innovate, you go to North Carolina, you go to Georgia, you go to South Carolina.

You see that they have express lanes.

You know, we have, our statutes don't allow us to have those.

And so we got to go and look at statutes where we're behind in other states and look at that because people want to decide if they want to pay a little bit more and go through the express lanes, they can.

And then lastly, we're going to have to realize that we are, that electric cars are, have one of the lowest, tax rates in the state.

We have to raise electric cars.

And we got to realize that sooner or later, that gas, combustible cars are getting more fuel efficient.

More people are buying electric cars.

So we are going to have to find some ways that, that outside of the gas tax that we're going to have to fund, fund the infrastructure.

And one thing when I was Ways and Means Chairman, in 2022, we put $125 million of state recurring revenue into that.

We matched it and that's what's called "After August" funds.

And we were drawing down 250, 350, 400 million dollars.

And there are ways that we've got to innovate.

And the state's going to have to put some resources into that.

Maayan> And you mentioned regulations.

D.O.T.

did say that they were cutting out a bunch of regulations this year.

I did want to quickly ask you, though.

There's been, again, chatter, a lot of chatter about the fact that the state maintains so much of so many of the roads here in South Carolina.

Is...does any part of this legislation, should we expect any part of this legislation to allow the locals to perhaps control more of these roads, especially to get some of these roads paved much faster?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, absolutely.

The answer is absolutely, we'll do that.

But when we did the 2017 legislation, we also allowed a road buyback.

We would pay the, the locals to take the roads back.

And there was very little interest in that.

So, you know, you're going to have to, you know, it sounds great to get some money up front on the local area, on the local arena, but they're going to realize that sooner or later they got to resurface and pave and maintain those roads.

And those are, there's not going to be money for that.

And so, you know, we're going to have to figure out a way that we can incentivize them.

And I think Chairman Erickson and Co-chairman Erickson and, and... Gavin> Crawford Spk Murrell> Yeah, Crawford, I'm sorry, I haven't...I'm not in political mode yet.

And rep...Heather Crawford have worked on that issue.

And hopefully you're going to see something in that regard.

Gavin> Mr.

Speaker, we'll talk about the funding in a second, you just touched on for infrastructure.

But I want to talk about growth in general, because we are in the Senate press conference and there was a, a big conversation about concerns about growth and keeping up with it.

Obviously, it's a good thing to have in a sense, but there are concerns about, you know, whether it's losing the culture or the identity in South Carolina and also the concerns about congestion and infrastructure.

Do you see any of the, like, broader ways to address this outside of just infrastructure when it comes to growth?

I mean, a lot of that is also made at the local level too.

Do you see any changes there that can happen?

I know home rule is also a big concern as well.

Spk.

Murrell> You have home rule and obviously that, that's a difficult nut to crack because the way you can do it is maybe see some impact fees.

And I think there will be some discussion of that when you see the, when you see the road bill rolled out here in a week or so.

But at the end of the day, you know, people are coming here because we got one of the greatest states in the country.

And, and you, and as long as people are building houses and neighborhoods, it's tough for you to, to ban the, you can't put a... We got a constitutional right to travel.

and so I couldn't agree with them more.

It's changing the dynamics of South Carolina.

It's changing the culture and the fabric of South Carolina.

But, you know, you also you got to, you can't put your head in the sand and say, we're not going to do anything.

You're going to have to be proactive.

And you got to continue to look and make investments that grow South Carolina and keep us a prosperous state.

Gavin> And to that effect, we're talking about money and investments for the infrastructure.

The governor in his budget, his proposal, mentioned spending $1.1 billion dollars in new money to expedite roads and interstate projects.

This is on top of SCDOT's request for an additional 300 million, I think, for it to expedite bridge replacements.

We're talking big money here.

Do you see that being actually feasible when it comes to that amount of money going around?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, I think you've seen the state invest in the past and taken a lot of the surplus money and putting it into the roads in big numbers, 3 to 500 million dollars.

You remember a lot of the ARPA money that we did not have to use ARPA money, a lot of that went to roads.

And widening the interstates.

And that has been, you know, obviously slow and but it is, it's going to really help with South Carolina.

So I am a proponent of taking surplus money and putting it there at D.O.T.

And, you know, for the last two years, we have given $200 million for the billion dollar bridge and repair in South Carolina.

And so we'll continue to fund that in a manner to which that D.O.T.

can still work on those bridges and, and keep it and in line with the construction of it.

But, you know, I think that is a wise investment for South Carolina to put a lot of resources back into our roads.

Maayan> Speaking of budget, as South Carolina grows, the demand on state services also grow, as you know, as especially former Ways and Means chairman, what other big budget priorities do you expect to see this year?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, obviously, infrastructure, as I talked about, and I think you will continue to see our emphasis that we put on law enforcement and crime and making sure that South Carolina has the tools necessary to, to prosecute people who are committing crimes and, to keep South Carolina safe.

So you'll see a lot of investment in that.

And again, I think the last thing that we don't get a lot of credit for, and when I first got elected, the biggest issue was education and teachers pay.

And, you know, I remember when we first got elected, our goal was to be at the southeastern average.

We are now leading.

We're above the southeastern average.

And so we're going to fulfill, government McMaster's last promise, to have a starting salary of a teacher in South Carolina for $50,000 and continue.

Not only did we raise the starting salaries, but we raised a whole pay band of teachers.

And we got to continue to focus that in that area of education, because that's the key, the key to South Carolina.

You have some workforce issues around South Carolina.

We're working on them.

I think we've made great improvements in that regard.

But you have to have the next generation.

So it's just not K through 12, high school.

It is the colleges and universities or technical colleges.

And we've got to make sure that we're all going in the same direction, and we're trying to fill the needs of our employees in the state, because businesses flock into South Carolina.

And we are, we are in unprecedented success right now of how, how our economy is growing.

We're the envy of the nation.

And I'm telling you, we got to make sure not to only deal with what's ahead of us for this next, this next fiscal year, but what's ahead of us for the next ten years, the next 20 years.

And that's the way we plan.

And I will say this as someone you know, I think the General Assembly and the governor and government in South Carolina ought to get some credit for the success because it just didn't happen accidentally.

It happened as a result of good policy and prudent management of, of your budgets.

And investing into South Carolina that led to, led to these results.

Maayan> Lastly, we know about some of the federal cuts that are coming in.

I'm thinking particularly about how some agencies have been asking for money ahead of that.

Also, focus like mainly, is on the SNAP cuts.

We know that there has been money requested to get ahead of some of the federal cost sharing, difference that is going to happen.

Do you have any concerns about the way that those cuts will have an impact on the state budget?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, they're obviously going to have impacts on the state budget if you if you wanted to backfill those.

But in my opinion, these are promises from the federal government.

They're not promises from the state government.

And if the state government's going to backfill what promises that the federal government is pulling back, then that's an impossible task.

So I don't think that's our obligation.

Our obligation is take care of South Carolina citizens.

But we didn't make, we didn't create these programs.

We didn't raise them.

What's happening is the COVID era... adjustments are that were meant to have be a short term fix, are now being pulled back.

And so, we're going to backfill that.

I don't think there's enough money in the, in the entire budget in South Carolina to, to, backfill those.

So, you know, I think there's ways we're going to continue to try to work and be efficient and help.

I mean, this is, you know, you looking it's not SNAP.

It's ABC vouchers.

It is Medicaid.

I mean there's a lot, there's a lot ahead of us as we go.

But we've got to you know, I think it's incumbent upon the government and the citizens of this state who want these programs to let their federal elected officials know the real consequences to them because they're the ones that need to solve this problem, not the state.

Gavin> Speaker, we have less than ten minutes left, and we've got a couple more things to get through.

We're zooming through this already.

But taxes was one of the priorities you spoke of.

And, right now we have enough money in the budget, recurring revenue to trigger another 10th of a percent in the slow march in reducing our income taxes in our state.

So getting to zero has been a priority for a lot of people.

It's also a big campaign talking point.

Everyone's going to promise that we'll get to zero.

How that happens is a bigger question.

You guys are trying to address it, but how do you see that path together?

You guys passed legislation last year in the Senate.

How does that benefit folks across the spectrum.

Spk.

Murrell> For the income tax reduction?

Well, affordability is the biggest issue.

in South Carolina and in this nation.

And so how do you make South Carolina more affordable?

You give people back the money that they earn and through their income taxes.

So I think that's a big issue of how we, of why you would want to do that.

And, you know, we passed a bill last year that raised, that lowered.

We were at six point one last year.

We're now at 6 percent for income tax, by the way, the highest in the southeast.

And, and we, we passed a bill last year that brought it down to 5.3 percent.

And, and we're going to continue.

Hopefully the Senate will look at that bill, and deal with that.

And we also going to have to deal with other taxes.

Property taxes is another issue that's, that's brewing out there- Gavin> That's always been an issue.

How do you like it?

Do you ever get to tackle it though?

...since we talked about it the Senate was talking about it too.

...that's such a hard one to crack.

Spk.

Murrell> It is a hard one to crack.

But, you know, you got to deal with your homeowners first and people cannot get taxed out of their homes.

And, you know, I always say this.

As people rush to Columbia to ask us to fix the property taxes that are voted on by the city and county councils and how, why that, why they don't hold their elected representatives, accountable for that?

That's a good question.

But, you know, at the end of the day, we have to make sure that citizens, especially the elderly, that are living in their homes and the taxes are going up, that at least that they can be have with, have some dignity and remain their last few remaining years, be in that home.

So you will hopefully see some, some legislation on that.

And the other one that, that I really want to see pass this year is the business personal property tax.

Businesses, if you rent, lease a copy or you own a desk, you own a computer, the local government sends you a tax bill for it.

And so, you know, that's one way that we can control costs and have more affordability is by it lessening those taxes on those personal property and then letting businesses be able to not raise or even lower their rates, There are things that they're producing right now.

Maayan> I want to ask about, a question or a topic that a lot of people submitted.

And that's energy.

We saw y'all tackle that topic, over this, this last year.

But there's been a lot of concern and questions about the future of data centers, retail choice.

What can we expect to see in this year on energy?

Spk.

Murrell> We...were ahead of the curve on energy.

And we passed a sweeping energy bill last year that I think is, is going to set, be one of those pieces of legislation.

When you look back 20 years from now that we said this was monumental for South Carolina.

And I want to tell everybody this and I'll say, this is, we are in a, A.I., whether you like it or not, you're going to have to embrace it.

That is what's going to drive this economy over these, next decade.

And we are in an AI arms race with China.

And I had the opportunity to go up to Washington, D.C.

and work with, legislative leaders, with the administration.

President Alexander and I went up there, and then we followed up having a, a virtual meeting with, the energy secretary.

And they are very proud of what we have done in South Carolina.

And they want to lean, They want us to lean in because you have to create more generation.

You have to create more generation for, to power our industries, to power our homes, our growing population and data centers.

And data centers is, whether you like it or not, that is the railroads of the 1800s.

That is the interstates of the 1950s.

And this is, this is a race that we have to win.

This country has to win.

And the Trump administration is leaning in on it and saying that we need to make sure that we have the fundamental infrastructure for the data center, I mean for the A.I.

If you don't have it, then guess where it's going to go.

It's going to be in China.

And so South Carolina is going to be a willing partner with them on that.

And we're going to lean in.

And I think, when we get restarting the VC Summer Nuclear Reactor, where no, where the ratepayers are not at risk, nor are the taxpayers at risk, it is going to be a, it's going to be a real, win for us in South Carolina.

And as a result of that bill, you've seen Duke and Dominion both announce new combined cycle gas plants.

And so these days of, of us being perilously close to brownouts and not being able to serve the citizens and the business in this state are going to be over with here soon.

Gavin> We have less than five minutes, Speaker.

I want to ask you about abortion because that's something we saw play out in the off season over in the Senate.

There was a bill very restrictive, conservative, very restrictive bill that is stuck in the Senate, right now, a subcommittee didn't advance to full committee.

A member of your chamber in the Senate are holding a press conference for another restrictive bill next week that's going to have a hearing.

Do you see any such legislation moving ahead?

We have that six week ban on the books that's been upheld by the state Supreme Court.

Is there any appetite for this?

Spk.

Murrell> Yeah, I think the one thing you going to see move now is this is these mail order abortion, medications, are being prescribed by people out of state and being, prescribed to citizens and having chemical abortions.

So I think you will see us move in the House quickly on that bill.

I think there's a hearing scheduled for next Thursday on that bill.

And what that bill does is it regulates, that, that medication on the, on the, drug schedules.

And so someone cannot come and prescribe that out of state.

And that's been a workaround that's happened.

And that is a, you'll see that bill move quickly through the House.

Maayan> And I do want to ask, just a quick question about just security, especially in light of what happened to, the former speaker in Minnesota and another...legislator.

We know that legislatures all over the country are taking security measures much, much more seriously.

What are you all doing in the House?

You don't need to give us, obviously, the blueprints, but does it concern you at all?

Spk.

Murrell> Well, so first and foremost, I'll say Melissa Hortman was a colleague of mine.

She was speaker.

I sat next to her the year before, she was not speaker.

Sat right next to me in our, in a conference with our speakers conference we had and, you know, that really brought it home.

You know, that's something that's real, that someone, you know, and this is not an abstract theory.

This is real life.

People are being harmed in politics.

And what's going on in political culture in this country is broken.

And it cannot continue to happen.

So what I have done is I have made sure that the House has spent more money on security.

If you when you come over to the State House, you're going to see new, you're going to see it, as harder to get in there and it's harder to run amuck in there.

You will see new X-ray machines, and you will see a lot more security in our, in our building.

And I'm not going to talk about the specific things that we have done, but we are, but my job as leader of the House is to protect my members and I'm going to do everything I can to protect my members, because I hope nothing ever happens like that in our state.

And but, you know, you have to be prepared and you have to make sure that you protect them.

And I am absolutely committed to that, as well as President Alexander and the governor.

Gavin> And that's great to hear.

Mr.

Speaker.

We have less than a minute left.

...I'm going to ask you one quick question, hopefully.

The governor, this is his last year, he's had a lot of legislative wins.

Briefly talk about your relationship with him and what you want to see in a successor for the next governor.

Spk.

Murrell> Well, it's been an honor to work with Henry McMaster.

He embodies what's good in South Carolina.

He embodies what a politician should be in South Carolina.

And, you know, it's been a, it's been a pleasure working with him.

And you look at the success because, you know, he hasn't, he hasn't concerned himself about what political wins he can have.

He's more concerned about what's best for South Carolina.

And that's what's made him a great governor.

And you've seen over the past three, over the past year, we were the only state that had 3 percent growth That is 72 thousand jobs to the state, to this state.

And that's a result of his leadership.

And we're one of the, and we're one of five states last year that unemployment went down rather than going up.

And so that's the collaborative approach he's taken.

He has worked with us.

And when I tell kids about, who want to be in politics, who do you want to emulate, I'll tell them, emulate Henry McMaster.

He governs by, by, coordinating and communicating his three C's, and Gavin> collaborating >> and collaborating.

Thank you.

He always, he always tells me I forget one of those, but at the end of the day, I hope citizens of this state understand you can have a performance artist, or you can have somebody that just wants to come and attack and get likes on social media, or do you want a statesman, someone that, that, that wants to make South Carolina better and that cares about South Carolina more than they care about their political career?

Gavin> Do you have an endorsement?

Spk.

Murrell> No, sir.

(laughing) I got to work with the winner.

Gavin> That's House Speaker Murrell Smith and Maayan Schechter with South Carolina Public Radio, Thank you all for joining us and happy session.

For South Carolina ETV, I'm Gavin Jackson.

Be well, South Carolina.

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